Introduction to Out-of-Body Experiences (Hosted By: Metalforever)
Date: Sunday, 7/28/2013 7PM Pacific, 10PM Eastern
Join Here: http://www.psionicsonline.net/psychic-chat
Introduction to Energetic Body II (Hosted By: Forge)
How to Find Damage and Fix it in the Energetic System
Date: Wednesday, July 31, 2013, 6PM Pacific, 9PM Eastern
Join Here: http://www.psionicsonline.net/psychic-chat
IRC Server: ird.dal.net
Class Log Provided By Forge:
21:01 Forge Welcome to my first class on Psionics Online, today i will be covering the energetic system, in a 7 chakra system, including the meridians.
21:02 Forge The best way to start a class on the foundations of the energetic body is to first try to define energy. The person that I personally think had given me the best idea to define energy is Dimitrianon,
21:02 Forge "What is energy? it is called by many names in many different cultures throughout the world, such as psi, mana, qi, life force, and magick. However, they all boil down to the same concept: a subtle force that underlays everything in the universe, that can be controlled and manipulated by us.
21:02 Forge Energy, by itself, is not a very descriptive concept. Its equivalent to just saying "matter," when talking about something physical. We must describe it. We can talk about something physical’s density, weight, conductivity, malleability, temperature, the list is never-ending.
21:02 Forge In the same way, we classify and enumerate different types of energy. However, as energy is a more abstract concept, we describe it in a more abstract way. As we interact with energy, we attach a concept, emotion, or sensation to it.
21:02 Forge You might hear someone say they encountered a thick, dark, negative energy, or something that was green, fresh, and liquid."
21:03 Forge - Dimitrianon, article on "What is Energy?"
21:04 Eyulf Could people see the same type of energy in different ways?
21:04 Forge Eyulf that is entirely possible depending on how a person decides to perceive the energy in the first place.
21:05 Voidmaster05 Bit like quantum mechanics then. Observation could change the thing being observed, yes?
21:05 Forge where one person might perceive textures and colors, one might perceive weight and consistency for example, which will give two very different outcomes for the same thing.ived according to whatever model the perceiver prefers?
21:06 LightSearch Would seeing chakras fall under this?
21:06 Foresight[Mem] What's unfortunate about it?
21:06 Eyulf My guess is probably harder to study.
21:06 lutasi The unfortunate part is that it can make it a real bitch to figure out what the fuck you're looking at
21:07 Forge its hard to pin down a single unit of measurement for energy, let alone an entire system in which to categorize it and make it a standard, but hopefully one day :D
21:07 amygdala @forge, agreed.
21:07 Frank_the_Bunny The issue is that the brain has to interpret stuff into things it knows how to process. Sights, sounds, objects, shapes, etc.
21:08 OldFire I'm guessing conditioning and paradigm familiarity may influence this as well?
21:08 Forge luckily we can do this, but as it is a very subjective process, its hard to make an objective standard .
21:09 Balgovet I guess that's why stable belief systems like the 7 chakra model are helpful, they're a way to frame these things so we can share experiences
21:09 Voidmaster05 I wouldn't say that Foresight. There is something fundamentally different about a human mind and a computer which may make all the difference.
21:09 Forge this particular subject will be for a scanning and perception class though
21:09 Eyulf Is it similar to the color example I mentioned before the lecture? Like I might see green ooze, and someone might see orange liquid, but they both mean the same thing?
21:09 Forge Eyulf quite possibly.
21:09 Foresight[Mem] So does that mean chakras only exist within the model that describes them? Someone who didn't expect them wouldn't see them?
21:10 Forge lets save that for a perception class though.
21:10 Forge Foresight[Mem], no, just because you can't see radiation doesnt mean it doesnt affect your body
21:11 lutasi That seems like a not so great comparison :\
21:11 CanICastYet energy is similar to radiation though no?
21:11 Forge simply an analogy, but one that brings a lot to the table. ignoring the energetic system when doing PK is entirely plausible, but why ignore such a useful tool.
21:12 Forge CanICastYet energy is defined by "vibrations", which can be interpreted as wavelengths, so yes.
21:13 LightSearch So the study of cymatics?
21:13 Forge i wouldnt say so
21:14 lutasi As far as I'm aware vibrations is more a convienient and widely used metaphor
21:14 Forge it is, thank you, lutasi
21:14 lutasi than any actual description of what's going on
21:14 Forge in essence, energy is everything, and the energy we relate to in energy manipulation is the subtle vibrations given off by everything.
21:14 Forge The energetic body structure we will be covering in this class is the 7 chakra system. The term chakra derives from the sanskrit word for wheel/'circle, as it depicts a swirling mass of energy in the body.
21:15 Forge That brings up the question, what is a chakra? A chakra is a point of energy in the body naturally formed by the soul when it inhibits a physical body. In essense, it brings in energy from around it, processes it into energy for the energetic body, and repeats.
21:15 Forge the process is quite a bit more complex than that, but for todays class, it fits well.
21:15 Loke What is a soul
21:15 Forge The energy created for the body depends on the chakra, how active it is, and the state of the body in question. Someone who is very happy and loving might have a lot of green energy from the heart chakra, for example.
21:16 Forge the soul is the full extension of consciousness. past this definition, which i have been working on for 3 or 4 years so, i cant really tell you ._.
21:16 lutasi sensing energy as green doesn't necessarily mean it's from the heart chakra though
21:17 Forge lutasi, it doesnt, but for that particular example, it would be the accepted location it would have been produced.
21:17 Forge and for the sake of ease in the 7 chakra systems i cover the colors, even though they dont necessarily mean anyhting
21:17 Loke so different chakras make different types of energy?or do we just perceive it as different but its all the same
21:18 Forge all energy has its own subtle differences, but its all energy, just like someone with red hair from ireland is still a person.
21:19 Phantomx9 Different Chakras are different states of well being (Dinensions of existence/consciousness)?
21:19 Foresight[Mem] Why are chakras colored?
21:19 Forge Phantomx9 i would disagree with that
21:19 Foresight[Mem] Is it for the sake of convenience?
21:19 Forge Foresight[Mem], the standard model colors them, i personally do not .
21:20 Forge i only list the colors for the sake of convenience to the standard model
21:20 Voidmaster05 I don't suppose we know why the different parts of the body make them differently.
21:20 Forge they actually relate to different glands in the body that control different functions
21:20 Forge (unfortunately i forgot to add that part in to my descriptions of the chakras)
21:21 Forge for example, people always talk about the penial when talking of the third eye, but in contrast, the pituitary is the physical location of the solar plexus
21:22 lutasi thyroid and throat chakra :P since when does that gland have anything to do with speaking
21:22 Forge There are plenty of systems, going up to many amounts of chakras, but for the purpose of this class and the following classes, we will focus on 7 main chakras, and many lesser chakras.
21:22 Forge lutasi, it probably doesnt. when does insulin production have anything to do with someone's ego.
21:22 OldFire Does the Taoist/TCM system (with Tan Tien, etc) contradict the sanskrit one?
21:22 Foresight[Mem] If one's chakra runs out of energy
21:22 Phantomx9 Just curious. So chakras don't promote different states of well being? What about whe a person experience their rootchakra, they feel more grounded?
21:23 Foresight[Mem] Are the effects of that chakra gone?
21:23 Foresight[Mem] Say your throat chakra runs out, would you be incapable of effectively speaking?
21:23 Eniri the tan tien/dantien is a different part of the body
21:23 Forge Phantomx9, this is true, i simply misread what you posted and thought you said dimensions of existence, sorry.
21:24 Forge Foresight[Mem], chakras can be worn down, but never completely depleted and devoid of energy. you may feel stress in that area when such a thing occurs, depending on how in tune you are with your energetic body .
21:25 Eyulf Insulin production has correlations with weight, and usually people who are overweight have a smaller ego, in the western sense.
21:25 Eniri a person with an underactive or drained throat might have difficulty speaking or expressing themselves. The effects are more subtle
21:25 Foresight[Mem] Originally being fat was an ego boost
21:25 Phantomx9 Thanks. I've read articles and from other people experiences. but yes what Foresight announced, can you reach a burnout poibt?
21:25 lutasi That depends on how close you look and what you mean by the word ego eyulf :P
21:25 Foresight[Mem] It meant you were healthy and rich
21:25 Forge Eyulf, true, but i would consider that reaching for an answer.
21:26 Forge you can burn out, but never completely deplete, and it tends to reach the physical in different ways, such as feeling tired, or sore.
21:26 Forge rown Chakra: top of the head, spiritual enlightenment, violet. Third Eye Chakra: center of forehead, perception and understanding, purple. Throat Chakra: Adams Apple/throat area, communication, blue. Heart Chakra: center of chest, emotion, green. Solar Plexus Chakra: center mass, ego, yellow. Sacral Chakra: lower stomach, intuition, orange.
21:26 Forge Root Chakra: groin/base of spine, self awareness and survival, red.
21:27 Forge For the sake of reference, here is a picture of the chakral system:
21:27 Eyulf True. Which definition of the word ego do you mean?
21:28 Forge each chakra produces energy from multiple locations, this energy is used in energy manipulaiton. feeling chakras is like feeling a tingle and a weight on your body at the specific place it is located, and is easiest felt during meditation.
21:28 lutasi Eyulf, could we get into it later it's kinda rude to sidetrack a class :P
21:28 Eyulf My apologies
21:28 Balgovet I'm surprised intuition is in the sacral, so close to the physical rather than the spiritual
21:28 Balgovet if you allow those distinctions
21:28 lutasi (or hey forge could answer it if he has one)
21:28 Forge any questions?
21:29 Foresight[Mem] When making a chakra in, say, a tulpa, should you explicitly program it to draw in energy?
21:29 Foresight[Mem] Or would that come naturally?
21:29 Loke How do we know these chakras are really there?
21:29 Forge Balgovet intuition is the basic primal instinct, so i can see how it would be closer to the physical
21:29 Eniri Balgovet, intuition in the sense of instinct
21:30 Balgovet Hmm, I guess I can see it that way.
21:30 Forge Foresight[Mem], in my experience, energetic bodies naturally over time develop into full systems as long as they have the means.
21:30 Flax Sorry I can't stick around for the whole class, have to go run some errands...
21:30 cedar do the chacra conect together at anytime to produce or draw a specific type of energy or vibration, or could they be used in this sense?
21:31 Forge cedar, that is what the meridians do.
21:31 Forge or the meridian system if you will
21:32 Forge There are other structures in the astral body, such as meridians(I have also heard them called tenketsu), that carry across the body, similar to the vascelar system. These structures are intertwined with the chakra system to deliver energy all across the body, and should be regulated just as carefully and as often as the chakras themselves.
21:33 Forge the meridian system carries energy, and regulates the flow of energy across the energetic body
21:33 Forge For the sake of reference, here is a picture of the meridian system and the chakra system, with the exception of the crown chakra.
21:33 cedar thank you.
21:34 Forge the major chakras act as "vital organs" and while intertwined with the bulk of the meridian system in a structure referred to as the core. the lesser chakras act as smaller versions of the major chakras throughout the meridian system, and typically are found on the pressure points on the body
21:34 Foresight[Mem] What purpose do they serve?
21:34 Forge do what serve?
21:35 Foresight[Mem] Minor chakras
21:35 Foresight[Mem] Just extra energy acquisition?
21:35 CanICastYet I beleive Foresight[Mem] means the minor chakras
21:35 Forge Foresight[Mem], they act similar to the main chakras, they react to the needs of the energetic body, pull in energy, and also relay energy to other parts of the body. their functions are very similar.
21:36 LightSearch Does the endocrine system fall under the meridian system?
21:36 Forge LightSearch to be honest i dont know
21:39 Eyulf Studies have shown that you can remove a hormone-enducing part of the body and stick it back anywhere, and it will still work perfectly fine. What would happen to a chakra that is associated with something that releases hormones if this happens?
21:39 Forge i would say it varies depending on the person, some people seem to be more in tune with each individual element, which would vary the energetic body as well
21:39 lutasi (the fith which is pretty much the same as fire but that's off topic)
21:40 Loke where do the chakras get the energy from?
21:40 Forge Eyulf, i dont know. that is over my head, and most definitely beyond the topic of this class.
21:40 Forge Loke, that is the next section
21:40 Forge the chakras pull energy naturally from 3 locations, one being what is mostly referred to as the mental realm, which is the closest layer of the astral to the earth, and because of this is influenced heavily by things happening on the earth and looks like a copy of the earth, if you have ever had an OBEE, more than likely it took place on the mental realm.
21:40 Forge dont be sorry, i am glad to move forward
21:41 Forge the second location the chakras can pull energy from is the area around the person on all layers of the astral that vibrates at the same frequency as the chakra in question, which is also referred to as ambient energy.
21:42 lutasi Disclaimer: a lot of people disagree about the structures of astral and slash or ethereal planes
21:42 Forge and the third being the core(also called the inner soul), which is where the most pure essence of your being resides, and is considered to be the most potent energy for a person to work with.
21:42 LightSearch On the second location, can you pull energy from another person?
21:42 lutasi yes
21:42 Forge lutasi, i understand, but for the purpose of the class, i will word it how i understand it, simply to get the point across easiest.
21:42 Foresight[Mem] When do you draw from that?
21:43 Loke can you decide which of the 3 places you pull f rom?
21:43 Forge Foresight[Mem], a small bit naturally regulates in and out of the system, but you can consciously pull from it as well
21:43 Forge Loke, it is a natural process, but you can consciously pull from one location more than another
21:44 OldFire Is the core infinitely energized, or can it "run out"?
21:44 Forge the core is most definately a limited source.
21:44 OldFire So it must be recharged?
21:44 Loke can it increase with practice
21:44 Eniri you can tire everything out but that's like saying the heart will only get X amount of beats
21:44 Foresight[Mem] What would happen in that case?
21:44 CanICastYet one of my friends often refers to a "well" of energy would this be the core?
21:45 Forge it naturally recharges itself, but yes, it can be recharged, and it generally takes a while to do so
21:45 OldFire Ok thanks
21:45 Forge CanICastYet, probably
21:45 CanICastYet thanks
21:45 Forge Foresight[Mem] you will probably feel like crap for quite a few days :)
21:45 Foresight[Mem] Lol
21:46 Voidmaster05 So the core is a small gathering of powerful energy, yes?
21:46 Voidmaster05 Just to clarify, lol.
21:46 Eniri the energetic body can have very real effects on the fleshy one. I know someone that had something draining him over a long period of time and he developed a heart murmur because of it
21:46 lutasi core is where the fun stuff is at P)
21:46 Forge Voidmaster05, i wouldnt say small, but otherwise, yes. it is the energy you will most naturally be able to work and do your best work with.
21:47 Forge this particular class will be transitioning into the training phase now.
21:47 Voidmaster05 Is it always slow to recharge?
21:47 Forge after all of the questions are answered, of course.
21:48 Forge Voidmaster05, compared to how easily you can obtain other energy, yes. gnosis meditation taps into regulating the core energy and producing more of it, so it can be recharged faster, but it does take longer that one would assume
21:48 Voidmaster05 I have had moments where I would completely fall apart physically after geisting, but it passed in a few minutes.
21:49 Foresight[Mem] Geisting?
21:49 Forge probably due to heavy stress on the energetic system, i would recommend developing your system to deal such large amounts of energy more frequently, you will be able to handle it much easier.
21:49 lutasi doing pk unconciously
21:49 Voidmaster05 Unintentional psionic activity
21:49 Eyulf Is energy used in perception, and if so, would that mean that it would be harder or impossible to see things such as chakras if you were momentarily burnt out?
21:49 lutasi like when you're chillin and suddenly your arm twitches
21:49 amygdala I have a bit of a two parter here.
21:50 Forge Eyulf, yes, and yes. perception can also be done completely on will alone, so not entirely impossible, and using very crafty programming, you can avoid using your own energy entirely for perception
21:50 lutasi no but it is to moving as geisting is to PK
21:50 lutasi just a handy analogy
21:50 amygdala First, you say that it is difficult to make an objective standard with regards to sensing energy. I completely agree; but I believe that is changing. I would love to have a chat about that at a later date.
21:51 Forge amygdala, i also agree on that point, and look forward to that conversation.
21:51 Eyulf Ooh. That would be fun. Perhaps have a way to determine the emotion behind it, rather than what's actually seen.
21:51 amygdala Second, you claim that energy is more abstract than matter. Do you believe that the energy is abstract or that our mechanisms of interacting with it are abstract? It seems like a parcing difference, but it makes a difference to my thought train.
21:52 Forge mechanisms of interacting with it are abstract. i fully believe and practice energy as if it were real, because to me it is.
21:52 amygdala Thank you for your time. Please continue.
21:52 CanICastYet I agree with forge there
21:53 Forge i dont want to force that opinion on others, so i word it differently, but for my perception, energy is real.
21:53 amygdala parsing*
21:53 amygdala compliments of lutasi
21:53 Forge The point of this lesson is to learn to pull energy from the chakras, move it around the energetic body, and get used to energy manipulation in the first place. for for anyone who would like to, the practice session comes up next, unless there are more questions
21:54 lutasi what's your favorite brand of cereal?
21:54 CanICastYet Where do babys come from?
21:54 Forge i also hope it gave a more in depth understanding of the energetic system for those who were already familiar with it in the first place as well
21:54 OldFire It did for me, or at least refreshed some things I'd read about previously
21:55 Eyulf Is there a reason that the energy colors are linked to the colors of the rainbow in exact order? I mean, I know colors are subjective, but is there a link between rainbows and the chakras?
21:55 lutasi what do they say to you on a philisophical level?
21:56 Forge Eyulf, i dont personally use the color system, its just standard to the 7 chakra energetic model.
21:56 lutasi Eyulf personally I think the colour thing came about because of the comparisons of "vibration" to "Frequency" and the colours being different frequencies of light
21:57 Eniri actually it would be the inverse. The lower ones tend to be dense and earthy (slow waves) and the higher ones are more active
21:57 Eniri but with light red is a more active color
21:57 Forge ^this being true
21:58 lutasi light wise red has a longer wavelength and lower frequency
21:58 cedar can one chakra override or influence another if they are inbalanced? and in the end the weaker chakra is thrown off or mis-produces its original programmed or desired effect or vibration?
21:58 cedar last question for myself.
21:58 Forge cedar very possible.
21:59 Eniri the colors are subjective and not that important. Historically, it's likely that enough people saw those colors and came to agree on them
21:59 Forge the activity levels of a chakra can imbalance one another, and cause problems,
21:59 Eniri which reinforces the way other people see them
21:59 LightSearch When over grid point on leylines, does that recharge Chakras faster?
22:00 lutasi Does saturating the immediate are with energy cause quicker regeneration?
22:00 Eyulf I like it, as it easily compares it to other waves.
22:00 Forge LightSearch its possible, depends on if you tap into that energy, otherwise no.
22:02 Forge anyway, if anyone would like to practice, now is the time.
22:02 CanICastYet what are we practicing?
22:02 Forge The point of this lesson is to learn to pull energy from the chakras, move it around the energetic body, and get used to energy manipulation in the first place.
22:03 Forge this will require going into meditation, and learning to feel the chakras. after feeling the chakras, learn to move the energy from them, and around the body.
22:03 Forge moving the energy along the meridian lines will move it faster, and through the lesser chakras will build up the amount of energy being moved.
22:04 Forge the point of this practice would be learning to manipulate the energy in the energetic body to maximize efficiency when practicing
22:06 Voidmaster05 I used to be that way too, thats why I use noise to put me into it. Right now I'm listening to some music in order to have something to focus on.
22:06 Eyulf It does that to a lot of people. The trick is to just note it, then sew it right back up.
22:06 CanICastYet I usually use nonvocal trance music to keep it smooth
22:06 Eyulf I have rainymood for white noise.
22:07 LightSearch Hemi Sync or binaural beats works best for myself
22:07 Eyulf I've tried binaural, but they've always made my ears ring after listening.
22:07 Voidmaster05 Something with harmony in it usually works for me.
22:08 Eyulf Also, since rainy mood has thunder, you could probably find something more flat by looking up waterfall on youtube.
22:09 cedar will this be a group practice or is it something done alone?
22:09 lutasi i dont know yet
22:09 Forge you would do it then report what happened here, where others can help you where you may have gone wrong or right